posted
We've got some good topics in progress so I hope we can entertain one more. The discussion Matthew and I are involved in has caused me to rethink how I believe about modern inspiration. I wanted to put some of my thoughts before you to see how you felt, or rather, believed on this question of inspiration.
Do you believe that when you write here on this forum that it is God impressing you to write? Does this "impressing" constitute inspiration?
What I mean is this; is it the Holy Spirit which provokes our thoughts and inspires us to write?
If we are not inspired by the Holy Spirit to write then by what? There is nothing good in man aside from Christ abiding in the heart. It is only by the Holy Spirit that wo/men are drawn to Christ, to think on eternal subjects.
If the Holy Spirit does inspire us to write then of what quality is that inspiration? Is it of the same quality as the Bible writers since there is one spirit, one Lord?
I believe that what is produced as a result of that inspiration depends entirely with the individuals consecration to God. If the man is not wholly the Lord's then his message will be tainted with the human element and will not be pure and therefore cannot be the exact expression of God's will.
I believe that God has given gifts to humans by the Holy Spirit and that godly men and women are impressed, or inspired, to write or act. And, although I trust the quality of the inspiration, because it comes by the Spirit of God, I do not trust the man (or woman) above or on an equality with Scripture. Yet, if what they say aligns with scripture I am inclined to accept that they were inspired by God.
I would be interested to hear your beliefs or thoughts and to even be challenged to rethink this somewhat. Of course, I do realize that some men are "inspired" by the Devil. The Bible should distinguish between the two forms.
quote:Originally posted by jqlogan: If the Holy Spirit does inspire us to write then of what quality is that inspiration? Is it of the same quality as the Bible writers since there is one spirit, one Lord?
I would be interested to hear your beliefs or thoughts and to even be challenged to rethink this somewhat. Of course, I do realize that some men are "inspired" by the Devil. The Bible should distinguish between the two forms.
Sorry, no challenge here today. However, I do have a statement. I guess the determining factor is the level of "purity" in the communication. In other words, how much static is in the communication? For example, is the signal analog or digital, and then is the information VGA, SVGA, etc all the way to HSXGA+. For those with a TV, I guess it would range from ancient black and white to high definition TV.
Also, how much of "you" is in the writings. Paul seemed to know when he was speaking his convictions, verses teaching directly from what The Lord gave him to say to the church. Maybe this is why he was allowed to "write" so much of The New Testament. What do you think?
Matthew
-------------------- Hope with abandon, all ye who enter here!
posted
I don't think we've lost the capacity for inspiration at all. I don't believe,as many do, that God opened a teeny weenie window of divine inspiration and that somehow we've managed to capture it all in what we now call the NT
I do believe the NT is authoritave as well as inspired. I think that's the difference. If someone has a vision or sees something from heaven, this can be helpful for edification or revelation. There are works that are prepared in advance that we can operate in. However, I would never say that a modern prophet can claim the authority of the Apostles. The Scriptures are our plumbline. As such we must always verify what we receive against proven inspiration.
The spiritual gifts are still in operation today. I think we just lack the faith to go get them!
posted
That is a very good point, John 2. "The Scriptures are our plumbline. As such we must always verify what we receive against proven inspiration." Seeing there is One Spirit which inspires all then there is truly One Author. Everything should agree in One.
quote:Originally posted by JeffL: Do you believe that when you write here on this forum that it is God impressing you to write? Does this "impressing" constitute inspiration?
What I mean is this; is it the Holy Spirit which provokes our thoughts and inspires us to write?
I have a few thoughts, that complement what is already being said here.
First, I speak what I believe to be the truth based on The Word, Experience through the Holy Spirit and The Feedback of Others. I'm very careful to nearly never say, "God told me to tell you..."
Rather, I find that if what I'm saying is a "Thus saith the Lord" for someone, the OTHER PERSON recognizes that. Very regularly, people report back to me how they have acted on something I've said and been blessed or changed, and often I don't even remember "feeling" anything in particular about what I said. "They were cut to the heart", as Peter's hearers were on the day of Pentecost. How many times had he preached the gospel before, yet there was a totally different response that day, because "The Holy Spirit had come"... and we know that they were filled over and over again, to speak the truth with power.
God gave us the Word, the Spirit and the Community, and we need all of them to walk in truth. To rephrase the old cliche, if you have the Word without the Spirit you will dry up, if you have the Spirit without the Word, you will blow up, and if you have the Word and the Spirit but no Community, you will flip out. With all three, you will grow up!
Blessings, Laurie Ann
-------------------- You & Me and Jesus. We are enough!
posted
I agree Laurie Ann- somehow you expressed just what I was thinking! I personaly would rather be surprised when I learn that something I had spoken in humility was used by God in someone elses life than speak something that I thought was "in the name of the Lord", only to find out later that that was not what God was speaking to that person at all. I also tend to be leary of anyone who says things like "the Lord told me", or "God has given me a word for you". Although I think that God certainly speaks through people today (as LA said- we need community), I also think there are- and always have been those who falsely claim this ability for themeselves.
posted
All, I appreciate your thoughts. However, the idea that I am trying to pursue is whether we just speak and God uses it as best He can or whether God impresses us to speak. There is scriptural evidence of the Holy Spirit participating directly in our actions, our thoughts, our dreams, and our speech. In one place the disciples were instructed not to plan beforehand what they would say when they came before the governor. The Holy Spirit was to give them their words they were to speak in that very hour.
If we are speaking merely our own words there can still attend a power to convict, yet not a godly conviction. Just look at all the motivational books and speakers who have been credited with changing millions of lives. Think of all the humanistic efforts to better our world. Yet, are these of God?
But what I am interested in knowing is whether we believe God "inspires" us to speak or whether we consider it to be just our own thoughts and words.
And, Yes, Laurie, saying "God told me to tell you" can be very offensive to someone who is not open to hear. But what about this one? "God told me to tell you that He loves you!" Doesn't God make it very plain to us that He does love everyone and doesn't this then lend validity to our opening statement that God told us to tell them something? "This gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world." "Go... teach all nations."
The gospel is a two-pronged message. One of either death or eternal life. So in preaching about the love of God we must also preach about the penalty of sin. Thus, aren't we justified sometimes when we say, "God told me to tell you such and such?"
But perhaps you were speaking of a direct revelation from God addressed to a specific person. That's seems extreemly rare these days.
posted
Yes, Jeff, I believe God speaks through us, and sometimes it is with a really strong feeling of inspiration. However! I think we must be very careful, because the flesh and the devil can also create a very strong impression.
There are some who set themselves up as "prophets" on the internet, on television or through books, and as time goes on their messages get further and further from truth. It is hard to draw the line as to when their message goes from being inspired to demonic - the devil "masquerades as an angel of light". I've heard people using spiritual language and quoting Bible verses to say what was plainly a destructive, deceptive message.
Interesting cross-pollination with the Bible thread, is that the human writers of the Bible didn't deliberately "write scripture". Most of them didn't expect their writings to become a permanent record - they just wrote their testimony, wrote what was happening in their lives, wrote a letter, collected oral histories and wrote them down. It was divine intervention that snatched these words and protected them through the ages as, "This is what God wants you to read! This says something about His overarching plan, His divine will, His way of working."
One of the biggest differences between the Holy Books of other faiths and sects and the Bible is that the Quran, the Vedas, The Book of Mormon and so on were written by a person (or people) claiming to have special revelation. The Bible is written in a completely different way. Even when "revelation" is claimed, it is "I had a dream and it looked like this... I spoke to the people and I said that..." which is slightly different from "I'm going to set everybody straight, I have God's Only Message". Even Jesus mostly quoted Old Testament proverbs and principles! His "new command" was really an old command!
Blessings, Laurie Ann
-------------------- You & Me and Jesus. We are enough!
Personally, I feel that if God did not inspire us then we would have little understanding and perhaps less appetite for spiritual things. I believe our thoughts and words can be inspired but as someone said, if we are not fully committed to Jesus then there is chance that self will be woven into the fabric destroying all value.
I take exception to your idea that the Bible writers didn't deliberately write scripture. I believe that most of them were told to write it out by the Lord. It would take quite a while for me to scour scripture to prove this but I recall vaguely some references suggesting the same. I know God instructed Moses to write out the judgments, statutes, and other things, in a book. The Ten Commandments written on stone by the finger of God were placed inside the ark but the book which Moses wrote was placed on the side of the ark. John the Revelator was told to write. The Apostles instructed to have their epistles read among the churches. And so on...
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However, I do have a statement. I guess the determining factor is the level of "purity" in the communication. In other words, how much static is in the communication? For example, is the signal analog or digital, and then is the information VGA, SVGA, etc all the way to HSXGA+. For those with a TV, I guess it would range from ancient black and white to high definition TV. 
