While most of the time it's not so deadly, people do a lot of crazy and painful things they think will please God. It's too easy to think your own crystal clear, burning logic is the voice of the Almighty.
How do we know for sure he's not sent by God? Just because he killed people?Just because "innocent" people are killed? What he did might not be right in our eyes but isn't God always in control - even in situations like this? Is not Europe and North America gradually taken over by Muslims? Are we not drifting further and further away from God?
-------------------- My Father speaks to me in OT too and I see Him everyday.
Does chubbena know God The Father, The Son Jesus-Christ and The Holy Spirit?
If yes, then how can such questions be asked?
Why do you provoke like only the enemy does?
How does God get praised, thanked and worship by your double speaking kind of attitude?
If you knew God, you would not keep on doing that at every opportunity as you do.
So I'll pray that chubbena gets to be saved according to God's will...and wait for the fruit of the Spirit to begin appearing before I ever waste time trying to interact again with that person...--Dear Lord, do reveal Yourself to chubbena and grant that person the repentance and the faith in Jesus-Christ Your Son and may the Holy Spirit seal the heart of that person. I ask in Jesus name...Amen!
-------------------- ...all blessings be with us all... Benoit Couture
I read the Old Testament, too, chubbena. I read it from the Hebraic mindset of those who wrote it all down for us. I know the Laws of God and what purpose they serve in this lower realm of existence. It's not secretive and mysterious, but our Western culture has worked hard to make it incomprehensible by rejecting the ancient intellectual approach.
Grace can trump those Laws, but only because it makes us even more just in God's eyes. Grace understands things those merely lawful cannot. But the Laws of God still work as they have since the Fall. They remain in force for those without grace, but those with grace are hardly less just. Grace will not lead us to unlawful behavior.
Strictly by the Laws of God, there was so very much wrong with Breivik's actions. Hating Islam? Okay, it's a religion of man, but they are far closer to observing God's Laws than all of Western Civilization. Frankly, the entire West is under God's wrath, and Islam as a form of civilization, will outlive the West. God backs His Laws that way. The only way to defeat Islam is to obey His Laws better, not by trying to carry an unjust murderous war against them.
Under the Laws of God, we are permitted only defensive warfare. Purely defensive; they have to come to you. Even then, you have to wage war in God's justice, and the ways of man hardly qualify. Most modern tactics are in defiance of God's Laws. How did Israel defeat her enemies? By holiness first. A just nation will go into battle finding the enemy already dead on the battlefield simply because the praise choir was in the first battle order. The unjust nation can't even face a scrawny kid with a slingshot. God backs His Laws. These miracles have not ceased, only our grasp of His Laws has died.
Brievik was a murderer. We do not fix political disputes by murder. We simply declare God's justice and trust Him to back it, to make us the winners. If He does not, He has other plans He didn't tell us about. Almost surely He would reveal those plans if we bothered to ask. The ways of man and his fallen logic are not the ways of God.
May you find mercy in repentance. We all need it, every day.
You guys read me wrong and are near sighted. You see the wrong doing of this man and mourn that he, most probably not a true believer, claimed himself a Christian, did such a horrible thing, put the faith to shame and gave the Muslims a much needed excuse to gain more rights than they already have which are equal, if not more, than everyone else. You don't see the wrong doing inside everyone of us, whose believe is questionable, claim to be a Christian, does away with His Law, puts our Lord to shame and provokes His anger so that He incites such a thing. I repeat, He is in control and He lets such happened for a good reason. Both Europe and North America have exchanged our Lord with a false god, our savior Jesus Christ with another chirst. The leaders, both political and spiritual, have led the peoples astray. We have embraced false teachings and the detestable for so long. It's time. We are to go through what the Israelites had suffered. The Assyrians and the Babylonians are coming. Perhaps you guys could never accept the simple fact that even evil/deceiving spirits and calamities are from God to fulfill His purposes and have to rewrite the Bible that He permits/allows evil spirits to affect mankind and that evil/deceiving spirits operate outside His eternal will.
Of course He permits Satan and the demons to carry out the prosecution of His wrath. That's no mystery to me. And I agree with the idea all of the West is deeply flawed, but I wonder if we mean the same thing by such words. Perhaps your style, word choice, etc., all rings the wrong bell in my ears. You sound very much like some folks whose teachings are a threat to real faith.
On the other hand, modern English is hardly capable of transmitting biblical thought without making it sound all strange. I noted above Western Civilization itself is deeply deserving of God's wrath by its very nature. And I agree we will see a steep rise in Satanic evil manifested in people all over the world. Tribulation has begun, though I seriously doubt it's The End. Even if it is The End, it won't come until things get far worse.
As a prophet of God, I have warned many this insufferable police state rising upon us now is God's wrath, and we would be wrong to resist it by human means. It's His wrath upon America for a litany of sin to long to write by human fingers. And I do rejoice to see His wrath, even as I weep for those who suffer individually in that wrath. I know some of it must inevitably fall upon my own household, but that's the way it works in this fallen world.
So maybe I do read you wrong, and I apologize if we actually do agree. Could I encourage you to work with me at making things a little clear?
This man, like 9/11, is a tool, not unlike the Assyrians and Babylonians which God used. You used the word "permitted" which I couldn't find in my Bible, I used the word "sent", which you might think it's a very poor choice of word but it's in my Bible. At the end of the day God is in control.
At least one word does: nathan. In my Hebrew lexicon it lists the following KJV translations for that word in the OT: appoint, bring, cause, deliver, give, grant, laid, lay, made, put, recompense, send, set, shew, suffer, up, utter, and yield. Some of those are equivalent in our usage to "permit." It's used of God quite often, as well as many other authority figures.
Hebrew tends to be a great deal more fuzzy than English. Hebrew writers understood clinical precision, but seldom thought it mattered. They would hardly presume to define God's motives and actions so absolutely.
Eddie, I guess the words "permit" and "send" marked the difference between our beliefs. However, I can't ignore the fact that He Himself claimed "I form the light and create darkness. I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the Lord, do all these things." It's scarier in KJV.
D, The two verses you quoted shown how unworthy for men such as I to live a relatively peaceful and uneventful life - and because of that I haved learnt to fear the Lord and not to try to understand each and every thing He does. Yes, His mysterious ways.
-------------------- My Father speaks to me in OT too and I see Him everyday.