House Church Talk - The human mind thinks Self and Us.

SameSpecies samespecies at
Wed Apr 14 15:28:29 EDT 2004

Hi brothers,

The heart of man, (the mind, emotions, and will), the soul of man is
deceitfully wicked.  The human mind thinks self and us.  It thinks about me,
and them, but the Mind of Christ when it says "Self", Self is Christ, and
when it says "Us", "Us" is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, the One.  I will
try and explain these statements with a little follow up to the emails on
all apostles and prophets.  I think it's import in our minds, to remind
ourselves of this;  that the human mind thinks first about self.  We need to
be reminded of this over and over, so that we can turn the mind to the
Spirit, because only in the Spirit can we receive revelation.  First, let's
look at an example in Eph 4:8-11, were the human mind says "us", and then
try to see how the Mind of Christ would say "Me", "Christ".  Lord let us see
that it is all about you.

Eph 4:8-11 "... gave gifts to men... that He might fill all things... And He
Himself gave some as apostles and some as prophets and some as evangelists
and some as shepherds and teachers,"

Now, because the human mind thinks self, I might understand these extracts
from Ephesians above, as; the "Gifts" here does not refer to the abilities
or enablement's for varied services, but to the various gifted persons in
verse 11-apostles, prophets, evangelists, and shepherds and teachers. That
after conquering and rescuing them from Satan and death through His own
death and resurrection, Christ in His ascension made the rescued sinners
themselves such gifts with His resurrection life and gave them to His Body
for its building up.  Then the human mind will go on to say, as we have in
the past, that these gifted persons, these "perfected ones will perfect the
others".  Yes, I know it is hard to believe we have said such a thing in the
past.  But, this is the human mind.  It thinks self, we must be the "gifts",
we must be the "gifted persons", we must be "gifts to the body".  We must be
the perfected ones that perfect the body.  Now, lets look at how the Mind of
Christ says it's Me, all about Me.

Let's look at Ephesians 4 again before we decide that we are the gifts to
the body.  But, this time lets remind ourselves that it's all about Christ,
that the Mind of Christ says, Christ only.  Paul says this in Eph. 4:1 "I
beseech you therefore, I, the prisoner in the Lord, to walk worthily of the
calling with which you were called,".  The human mind starts out to replace
Christ this way, it says "o.k. we know Paul was in Jail for his ministry
work".  But, is this what Paul is saying?  Of course not, Paul is saying "I,
the prisoner in the Lord".  I dwell in the Lord, I am imprisoned by Him, I
am surrounded by Him, I am pressed in on all sides by Him, in all, through
all, over all, all about the Lord.  Next, in the verse the mind says because
it's about me, I must be worthy in my calling, my ministry, the gifted
person that I am, the gift that I am to the body.  The mind says it all the
time, it ask us "what is your calling?, what is your ministry?, what is your
gifting?"  But, the Spirit says "I called you", "I sealed you", "you must
follow me to be a son of God", "I am the One who called you".  It's not a
"with which" you were called, but a "by whom" you were called, it's all
about A Person, the Lord.  Remember God is Spirit, the Lord is Spirit.

Eph 4:2 "With all lowliness and meekness, with long-suffering, bearing one
another in love".  The mind says I must try to be meek, lowly, etc.  The
Lord says "I am the true Vine, apart from me you can to nothing, your works
are as dirty rags".  The Spirit says these are my fruits, that is why these
things; meekness, long-suffering, patience, etc. are called the fruit of the
Spirit.  The Mind of Christ says me means Me, and not you.  It says "in
love", God is Love, it means "in God.  God is Love, God is Spirit".

Eph 4:3 "Being diligent to keep the oneness of the Spirit in the uniting
bond of peace:"  Again, the Lord says it's all about me, He's even the
uniting bond of peace, He said My Peace I will give you.  What was the
Lord's Peace?  What was the Lord full of?  In the Holy Spirit there is Joy
and Peace, God is Love, God is Spirit, God is our Peace.

Eph 4:4-6  "One Body and one Spirit, even as also you were called in one
hope of your calling;  5  One Lord, one faith, one baptism;  6  One God and
Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all."  The human mind
acknowledges that there is just One.  But, I am not sure it sees that all of
these "Ones", in these verses are truly just "One", and I know it would not
have us see that theses "ones" are the "gifts" Paul is talking about in
verse 8 below.  The human mind doesn't see it because it says something must
be about me, I must be something.  But, let's look at these verses again.
What is the One Body?  Is it not Christ?  Is not the Body of Christ, Christ?
Don't let the mind tell you it is about us.  What is the One Spirit?  Is not
God Spirit?  Is not the Lord the Lord Spirit, the Spirit of Jesus Christ.
Now, we already talked about what "The Calling" was earlier, and by whom we
were called.  You were called by a Person.  But, this verse also mentions
"hope", so what is our hope?  The scriptures say Christ is our hope, they
say we are saved by Hope.  I don't want to get off the subject, just take a
close look one day at all the uses of the word "hope" in the New Testament.
You will see that "hope" is used just like "grace", not by our power but by
the Grace of God, the Spirit is even called "the Spirit of Grace".  Hope is
just like so many other terms used in the scripture, at times to state
Christ.  It may be just out of the respect the writers had for the name of
God, it maybe that not all are to be given the understanding, or it maybe
something else.  But, just as we have the Spirit of Truth, Jesus said "I am
the Truth".  Do we not rejoice in the Hope, the Glory of God.  Now, the mind
is probably telling you I am mixing my metaphors, taking it out of context,
etc.  Let's just hold our discernment for a couple of minutes until we see
what the remaining verses point out.  It's says in this verse "in one hope".
Is not Christ our Hope?  Is not God One?  What does the word "in" mean?  Are
we not to be dwelling in Him and Him in us?  Did Jesus not say "the Father
and I am one", "That they all may be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and
I in You, that they also may be in Us".  Yes, we have a hope for many
things, but in this verse it is the "one" hope, can any of us say that our
"one hope" is not the Christ.  Let's look at the "one faith" mentioned in
verse 5.  What is this faith?  We see this faith is one.  Is it possible
Paul is not talking about this one faith as being a belief system of ours,
or a concept in our mind?  The human mind wants to tell us it is about us
again, it is our faith, our belief, our understanding, or that some how we
("we" is the "self" again), must some how have the same believing,
understanding, or a part in it, that we need to do something.  Well, again
the scriptures call Faith, the Spirit of Faith.  The scriptures say "let
faith have her perfect works".  Faith is the substance of the thing not
seen, does not the scriptures say God is invisible.  Faith is the thing
hoped for, is not Christ our Hope?  Let us think about our own experience,
is God not the one who called you?  You were called in Faith.  We have
Faith, Hope, and Love a perfect picture of the God-Head, Love is the
greatest, the Father is greater.  Are we faithful or is God the one who is
faithful.  If we see that it is all about the One Person, we will not let
the mind think it has anything to do with us, you are saved by Faith, not
our own works, our believing or understanding.  What about the one baptism?
Yes, we have the outward ceremony, but is that the reality that Paul is
speaking of in Ephesians?  The reality of the one baptism is again the One
Person.  The baptism is the baptism into the One Spirit.  We die, the us,
the self, and are resurrected in a new life, this Life is the One Person.
Jesus said "I AM the Life", He is the Lord Spirit.  Jesus said "I AM the

In Eph 4:4-6 we have many "ones"; one Body, one Spirit, one Calling, one
Hope, one Lord, one Faith, one Baptism, one God, one Father of all, who is
over all and through all and in all.  These "ones" are all a "One".  This
One Person is the "gifts", all these ones mentioned above are the many
gifts, but "One" gift.  God gave us one gift of Hope, one gift of Faith, one
gift of one Calling, one gift of One Baptism, one gift of One Body, etc.,
etc.  Let's confirm this in the context before we start back to think we are
the gifts.

Eph 4:7 "But to each one of us grace was given according to the measure of
the gift of Christ."  Here we see "grace" is given.  It is given from Him,
it is of Him.  The scriptures say not by my power, but by the Grace of God.
Grace is God's power.  Does this sound familiar; "we are saved by Grace" and
in another place "saved us and called us with a holy calling, not based on
our works but on his own purpose and grace".  It is His grace, not our
grace.  It is a "holy calling", can anything but God be holy, can anything
but God call you?  The human mind says self, God says "his own" Grace.
Grace is another term that when we see the Person, we see the Spirit of
Grace as the scriptures state, and we drop the self.  Most importantly, in
this verse we see Christ is the gift, it is "the gift of Christ".  According
to the measure, again the measure is from God, it is God also, of the Gift
which is Christ.  Again, Him not us.

Eph 4:8 "Therefore the Scripture says, ``Having ascended to the height, He
led captive those taken captive and gave gifts to men.''  Here it says
"....gave gifts to men.", it does not say He gave gifted men to men, or that
the men are the gifts, we jump to this conclusion because we think it is
about us.  If I give you a gift are you the gift?  No, what I gave you from
me is the gift.  The thing that you received from me or of me is the gift.
Now, what He gave was Himself in Eph 4-6, that's why it says in verse 7 "the
gift of Christ", Christ is the Gift, Gifts in the form of the many Ones in
verses 4-6.  It is the self that says I am the gift, and the self that says
we must be the gifts to the body.

Now, as we breeze over verses 9-10, we need to see that Paul did not
transition off the subject of this One, this One Person.  These verses are
all about this One Person, if we don't see this Person we will be deceived
when we get to verse 11.  Verses 9-10 say "He ascended, He led captive, He
descended, He might fill all".  The Greek doesn't say "all things", the
Greek text is just "might fill all".  All not as in us "all" being something
or gifts, but us as in empty vessels, that He might fill all.  Paul said
before "not I that lives, but Christ that lives in me".  It's not about us,
it's all about Him, Christ.  In this verse Paul is still talking about "HE,
HE, HE, HE".  Now, let's look at how we bring the "self" into verse 11.

Eph 4:10-11  "... that He might fill all (11) and He Himself gave some as
apostles and some as prophets and some as evangelists and some as shepherds
and teachers,".  To see, that Paul did not intent for us to think we are the
gifts or the gift to the body, we need to state this verse as it is
literally found in the Greek text.  Here is the literal translation  "...
that he might fill the all 11 And himself gave the indeed sent ones,  the
but spokesmen,  the but tellers of good message,  the but shepherds and
teachers,".   Who does it say is the Gift in these verses?  Christ, He
fills, He is the Gift to men.  Look at the first three words in the literal
translation of verse 11, "and HIMSELF GAVE".  Paul is not saying, as we want
to understand it, with the self centered human mind, "and he himself gave
some as".  What Paul is saying is, "and of Himself gave, the indeed....".
We can't make this point strong enough "and HIMSELF gave".  Christ said, "I
will build My church".  Dear brothers and sisters do not say I am a gift to
the body, I am one of the many gifts to the body, this is the self, the
flesh nature.  Instead, only say Christ is the Gift to the body, Christ is
many, but One Gift to the body, Christ will build His body, Christ is the
only One Who can perfect, Christ is the only Righteousness.  Please don't
let the self, tell you that you are a gift, that is for the perfecting of
the body.  A true sent one like Paul says "not I, but Christ, His glory in
the church, not mine".  Not by my works or power, but by His Grace.  You
were created for good works, but they are not your works.  Let Faith have
"HER" works, the Spirit of Faith.  We can bare no fruit apart from the Vine.
It is not us as sent ones, teachers, etc, etc., that perfect the body, it is
of "HIMSELF gave" for the perfecting of the body.  Can you're self, have
anything to do with building Christ's body?  Can you're self, do any
perfecting, or isn't the self to go to the cross, and be denied daily?
Don't touch the Ark of God with a human hand, the results is death.  See
that it is all Christ, all about Him, and the rest of Ephesians will also
take on a whole new meaning, were God gets the glory, and "ourself" is put
under Christ's feet.



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