House Church Talk - Re: Look who Jesus Chose

jim pierceall jpierceall at
Fri Apr 30 10:38:14 EDT 2004

Hi Ross - You expressed your cessationist position again w/ this - <<But I
think gifts were already passing away by then>>

So I almost feel silly to bring this up and ask you.... yet....?

Rom 1:11-12
11 For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift, to
the end ye may be established;

12 that is, that I with you may be comforted in you, each of us by the
other's faith, both yours and mine.

Note: to the end <eis> you may be established...  ever think on that any?
And if that end has come, does that mean we now operate and function under
some other form of faith, than the faith Paul hoped might be established and
enhanced by the "spiritual gifting"?

This "spiritual gifting" would be NT:4152
pneumatikos (pnyoo-mat-ik-os'); from NT:4151; non-carnal, i.e. (humanly)
ethereal (as opposed to gross), or (daemoniacally) a spirit (concretely), or
(divinely) supernatural, regenerate, religious:

KJV - spiritual. Compare NT:5591. which would be held in human expression,
not Divine method of Holy Spirit enablements...

Of course if you believe "spirituals" 1 Cor 12:1 <pneumatikos>" has ended,
then we indeed have a far different and altered "grace" than what Paul was
out to proclaim and see believers establish IN...

There is no doubt, we witness many out today to establish a cerebral
expression of faith - but was it ever authorized, is the question?

Grace = God enabling us to do, what we could never do for ourselves...

Has that changed?  Thanks for sharing, and allowing me to springboard...


BTW:  I surely love this picture!  verse 12  "that I with you may be
comforted in you, each of us by the other's faith, both yours and mine. "

Appearing that we get to see rich method Paul saw himself "in fellowship" w/
other's and not Lording it over them...  He wanted HS operating in other's
lives, that he might turn and partake, and harvest fruit and growth unto

Far cry from the often supposed Mighty Paul-isms expressed today ...  No
wonder believer's cried and hated to see him depart...  Differing
dramatically from the "relief", we often feel today when the "high and
mighty" depart our abodes... O;>)

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