House Church Talk - Baptisms and Administrations
bwood4d at hotmail.com
Fri Feb 13 21:49:41 EST 2004
When I wrote:" God never had a "purely Jewish mission"!! ...
You responded:"As you noted with Christ going only to the lost sheep of
Israel and commanding His disciples to do likewise, there was indeed a
purely Jewish mission for awhile. You see, before the Gentiles could be
blessed through Israel according to the New Covenant, Israel had to get
right with God and thus John the baptizer's mission. Israel first, then the
rest of the world."
Dear brother, Israel has never gotten right with God, and yet great blessing
has come to the Gentiles! Great blesing came to Seth, Noah, Abraham
etc.(Gentiles before Israel ever existed!) Great blessing came to Job
totally apart from Israel. Great blessing came to Gentiles during the
ministry of the Lord Jesus even while most of Israel flatly rejected Him!
As far as new covenant blessing is concerned, the new covenant had not even
been made when the Lord and His disciples were going just to the lost sheep
of the house of Israel. Under the new covenant, far more gentiles have come
into blessings than have Israelites!
I had written:"The Ethiopian eunuch, the household of Cornelius, and many
other Gentiles were already members in the Body of Christ. Some of them even
before Paul, Himself!!! "
You responded: "These were saved and certainly part of the household of God,
but they were not members of the "Body" until it was created. One can not be
a member of something that does not yet exist! The Eunuch was not an ethnic
Jew but he was a religious Jew. Cornelius' status as a "God-fearer" implies
a special sympathy for the Jewish religion if not the intent to become a
proselyte at some point."
Brother Ross, If you agree that these were saved and part of the household
of God, why would you say that they were not members of the body of Christ?
The body of Christ is first mentioned in Romans 12:5 (A.D. 60) but the
household of God is only mentioned in Ephesians (A.D. 68)! If the place
where something is first mentioned in scripture indicates when it was
"created", then the household of God did not exist until A.D. 68!! Do you
see how such thinking is faulty?
While Paul was the first one to whom it was revealed that the nature of the
unity of the Spirit was that of a BODY, he was certainly not the first to
whom it was revealed that there would be A UNITY OF BOTH JEWS AND GENTILES!
To Jacob, as far back as Gen.49:10, it was revealed that there would be
a gathering (singular) of the peoples (plural) unto a man of the tribe of
Judah designated "Shiloh" or "peacemaker". " The sceptre shall not depart
from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and
unto him shall the gathering of the people be."
Isaiah speaks of the same in Isaiah 49:6."And he said, It is a light thing
that thou shouldest be my
servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of
Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest
be my salvation unto the end of the earth."
Caiaphas, the High priest of Israel prophesied of the same thing in John
11:50-52 so it was yet future at that time."Nor consider that it is
expedient for us, that one man should die for the people, and that the whole
nation perish not. And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest
that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for that nation; And not for
that nation only, but that also he should gather together in one the
children of God that were scattered abroad."
This oneness was yet future when the Lord Jesus was here. He spoke of it in
John 10:16 and 17:11,21,22,23. (A.D.37)
"And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring,
and they shall hear my
voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd."
"And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come
to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given
me, that they may be one, as we are....that they all may be one; as thou,
Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the
world may believe that thou hast sent me. And the glory which thou gavest me
I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: I in them, and
thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may
know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me."
But in Acts 15:7-11, Peter spoke of this unity as an already accomplished
fact and James concurred with him in Acts 15:13-17. (A.D. 55)
"And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them,
Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among
us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and
believe. And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them
the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us; And put no difference between us and
them, purifying their hearts by faith. Now therefore why tempt ye God, to
put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we
were able to bear? But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus
Christ we shall be saved, even as they."
"And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and
brethren, hearken unto me:
Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take
out of them a people for his name. And to this agree the words of the
prophets; as it is written, After this I will return, and will build again
the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the
ruins thereof, and I will set it up: That the residue of men might seek
after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the
Lord, who doeth all these things."
Ross, can you tell us when you think the Body of Christ was "created"? How
did those who were
already believers get into this Body? All who are members in it are
baptized into it by the Spirit. When did/does this happen?
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