House Church Talk - Phil & his Visualizing

[Phillip Cohen]

Thanks, Jim.

Anyone got time for a slightly long post?

I'm part of a loving, caring local body. I have many close friends in
Christ outside the local body who know me quite well. I'm also involved
in a music ministry that holds each other in close accountability. They
all testify I'm steadily growing in the Lord. 

My wife of 28 years and 9 children, ages 13-26 haven't seen a lack in my
passion for Christ. I still try to read 2-3 chapters per day in the Word.
I get up between 4 and 5 am, (sometimes as early as 2:30 am) and spend
quiet time with God.

No, my conscience isn't troubling me.

In the original post, I wrote the following:

"No, I'm not looking for a debate over whether this type of program is
right or wrong. An upbeat, inspiring discussion on this topic would be
very refreshing."

I wrote that because I know visualization is sometimes controversial.
(Yet, we all visualize) Also, I didn't want to take time for the endless
debates sometimes generated on these lists. I just wanted some brothers
and sisters to stir up their holy imaginations with me. 

I appreciated the responses that came from a few on this list and some
personal friends not on this list.

Here are a couple of the best:

"You can just release those (fears).  You aren't making anything up here
… not going to fabricate anything, Philip … you're going to focus your
attention upon what you know to be true of Christ … and see yourself
becoming more and more Christ-like in the process … I think that’s a very
good thing to be and do."

And this one came from a widowed sister whose husband had been one of my
closest friends:

"I visualize Jesus in different ways depending upon my situation at the
time.
 
Today when I close my eyes and allow my surroundings to disappear. I see
Jesus walking on the sand next to an ocean with waves higher than His
head. He has His hands on His back, just strolling along. That is what I
need today with all the turmoil and confusion I am dealing with.
 
Sometimes I see His hand as He covers me in the cleft of the rock as He
did Moses.
 
Sometimes I see Him as a child running, laughing, and tumbling free from
all care.
 
Sometimes I myself in His arms stroking my hair and carrying me.
 
So I think my image of Him changes with my need."
 
No, I wasn't asking anyone how tall Jesus is, what color His hair, or the
size of His nose.

Aw, forget it. 

Phillip
spiritfilledhome at juno.com
God is love, and all who live in love live in God, and God lives in them.
1 John 4:16

On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 21:53:04 -0600 "jim sutton" <goodword at bresnan.net>
writes:
> Well, we often do run, don?t we?  Our feet so swift and eager to shed 
> innocent 
> blood.
> 
> I went back and looked again at your original post, Phil, on 
> Visualizing 
> Christ.  And I must say I was shocked.  I saw nothing there to merit 
> the 
> carrying on that has followed on this list.
> 
> Granted, the words and terms you used historically provoke backlash 
> from 
> Christians.  Many of us have heard the sermons, listened to the 
> tapes, read 
> the books produced by Christian leaders against new age stuff.  And 
> I agree 
> with the typical Christian stand against new age garbage.
> 
> But Guys, stop and take a breath.  Rather than carry on, and on, and 
> on with a 
> "friends of Job" routine, stop and see what Phil really said.  
> Respond with 
> reason, and not like any insect that just acts out of instinct.  
> 
> God reveals His truth most perfectly in His Son, the Lord Jesus 
> Christ.  And 
> He also reveals His truth perfectly in the Scriptures.  But He does 
> not stop 
> there.
> 
> Often we may hear/read a story (like Pilgrim's Progress) that is not 
> 
> Scripture, and not the quoted words of Jesus or an apostle -- but is 
> still 
> used of God to break thru to us with a fresh awareness of a truth.  
> And the 
> Lord may even use a totally secular source to rattle our brains, 
> stirring up 
> our awareness of a truth of God.
> 
> The truth does not come from the secular source, or even from the 
> servant of 
> God.  The truth always comes from God.  And often it was already in 
> our minds. 
>  We just needed to see it from another angle to see it again.
> 
> C.S. Lewis (I know, now I'm sunk) talked a lot about this in many 
> places.  He 
> was a student of medieval literature.  And even in the most 
> ridiculous pagan 
> sources, Lewis could see glimpses and reflections of God's truth.  
> Granted, he 
> agreed that they were distorted by fallen human minds.  Yet he 
> believed that 
> the truth of God cannot be totally hidden.  The Light (of John 1:4,5 
> & 9) 
> shines so brightly that it touches and influences even darkest 
> humanity.
> 
> And Paul saw -- even in pagan poetry -- a truth of God, as he quotes 
> in Acts 
> 17:28: "For ?In him we live and move and have our being?; as even 
> some of your 
> own poets have said, ?For we too are his offspring.?"  
> 
> (Boy, would he have been chewed on for such comments by this list!  
> The very 
> thought that common people are all God?s children!  If that isn?t 
> new-age, 
> nothing is.  But was Paul really teaching that all are God?s 
> children, or 
> simply using those words to point to a genuine truth?)
> 
> Yes, we do need to stand for the truth of God's Word.  The Bible is 
> the 
> authority over every thought, belief, and teaching.  And that should 
> be enough 
> said, among brothers and sisters in Christ.  
> 
> But to gang up and try to skin a brother alive for sharing something 
> 
> thoughtful and real is stupid and wrong.  It's time to back off and 
> cool down. 
>  Those big guns you want to aim at a good brother need to be aimed 
> at the real 
> enemy we all have in common.
> 
> Like Job of old, Phil keeps trying to explain what he means, why he 
> has taken 
> his stand.  And like those lousy comforters of old, you keep trying 
> to find 
> and prove the flaw.   ?Lemme at that speck there, Phil.?  And like 
> those 
> ?friends? of Job you get even more riled up when your victim 
> complains about 
> your attitude.
> 
> This same Pharisaical attitude has already chased off a lot of good 
> brothers 
> and sisters from this list.  Do you really want to be left with just 
> 
> yourselves?
> 
> Take a breath, Guys.  Look at your own reactions and ask the Lord 
> for wisdom 
> here.
> 
> Jim
>