House Church Talk - Visualizing Christ

[jim sutton]

DanG wrote:

>Yep, Jim, I hear ya.
>OTOH, I would also not scorn the strong words from brethren.
>In my opinion, this is what happened in this thread recently.
>Strong words are as valid as freeform acceptance of what some do.  The
>strong words offer us a counter to merely accepting any idea/practice
>that comes along.  There is a place for "watchman" as well as
>"peacemaker."  


You make a very good point, Dan.

But I think you would have to agree that it all depends on what the strong 
words are, and who is doing the talking.  It is very difficult to hear strong 
words when they go against what we really, really like to do.

Several on this list did in fact "scorn the strong words" I recently shared. 
 When I spoke up against the ideas and practices of some members of this list, 
even you were upset with me.  And one or two others even left the list because 
of my strong words and my inability to accept the ideas and practices of those 
who still continue to feel angry because they only acted out of love.

I was very serious when I tried to point our attention to Job's comforters. 
 These men were Job's friends, you know.  They were not strangers, or 
counselors brought in from some far away place.  They knew Job, and they also 
knew the Lord.

And yet, instead of helping Job (if there was anything at all that any man 
could even have done) they just kept hammering on him, as was I suppose, their 
custom.  They knew lots of things to say.  The things they said were 
acceptable things, things Job himself may have even said in times past.  But 
the things they said did not apply to Job's situation.

They were convinced of his wrong doing -- how else could he be in the 
situation he was in?  How else could say the things he was now saying?  So 
they just kept giving him help.  All in the name of friendship and truth, no 
doubt.

Was it wrong for them to be there?  No.  Was it wrong for them to speak to 
Job, trying to ease him up out of his very great despair?  Of course not.

Did they say things that were basically untrue about sin, about God, about 
life as a man of faith?  Not really.  If taken alone, their words can prove 
helpful and basically good.

So what was so wrong with what they did?  The Lord made them go to Job in 
order to receive forgiveness, saying that they had not spoken things true of 
Him, as Job had done.  Why?

Maybe if you can see and understand their error, you will also be able to see 
what this list -- or any group of Christians, anywhere -- can also fall into. 
  All of us have been guilty, I think, at one time or another.  But we should 
not make it a habit, a pattern of behavior.

Unless we expect every Christian in the entire world to speak and look and act 
exactly as we do, then we need to give people some room to be different, so 
long as they are not promoting carnality or evil in some way.  If they merely 
read from some terrible modern translation, or wear bright red pants to every 
single meeting, or sing songs we can't stand, or if they use wording, or ask 
questions that we wouldn't, we do not all need to beat them up for it -- even 
if we are beating them with much love.

I believe that Job's friends really felt bad for him.  They really wanted to 
see him get back on his feet again.  And they were convinced that if he would 
just submit and do as they kept telling him, then everything would get better. 
 They could not understand why he kept telling them that he hadn't done 
anything wrong.  They couldn?t accept that.

Our duty as believers in the hc or in any other Christian group, is not to 
force everyone to conform to our manner of thinking and expression.  It is for 
God Himself to sanctify us, setting us apart from the former things, making 
all things inside -- and eventually outside -- new.  Yes, we are to comfort, 
to provoke, to urge, to warn, to grab hold of (to even shake awake, if need 
be), each other in the Lord.  But the goal is not to pit one kind of religion 
against another (east vs. west), but to always point everyone to Christ Jesus 
Himself.

Unless we really like being all alone, we must learn to express our love for 
the body of Christ in truly helpful ways.  God?s love really will direct us in 
our behavior.  And we know that God's love does not always accept everything 
we do.  But God?s love, God?s grace, God?s Spirit does not conform us to 
ideals of this or that group of people, rather it changes us more and more 
into the very image of Christ Himself.


Jim