House Church Talk - House church or simply church wherever people are

[Glenn Frank]

Hey Dan and Dan...

I'm thinking that the 'pastor' issue is really not so much an issue of
structure of the church... Or even authority issues necessarily... It is the
misconception that the 'pastor' is a job description rather than a Gifting
and means he is the one in charge. Not what I see in scripture.

Seems to me that a pastor is really just someone in the church who is GIFTED
with the pastoral GIFT... That is, someone who is sensitive to the needs of
people, is very relational and has a calling to protect them and the truth
of scripture. The person gifted as a pastor might additionally be gifted as
a teacher and a love for study and presenting Gods Word.

But the IC has taken this and made "Pastor" an office of authority rather
than a gifting that is to be used to better the church. It is true that men
gifted with the pastoral gift and calling might also be recognized as ELDERS
(now that is an actual 'office' of authority in the church... Not the gift
of pastor).

But what is more grievous to my heart is that the IC has the audacity to
give the title of "Head Pastor" to a man. Let me explain:

If 'pastor" means 'shepherd'...
And 'Head' intimates that he is the 'chief' leader...

Then they are calling this man the 'chief shepherd'... Which is a title of
Jesus -- the head of the church-- not a title fit for a servant leadership
'under-shepherd' as he should be!


Glenn Frank






On 7/28/04 6:42 AM, "DanG" <dan.dgordon at gmail.com> wrote:

> Dan Beaty wrote:
>> But first of all I am thinking of our communications in this forum and in
>> our meetings. We need to  affirm the true gift of shepherd in the church
>> while we reject the right of a man to dominate the gathering of saints.
>> 
>> Therefore, someone in this forum or visiting a meeting would have not cause
>> to think that we believe and live contrary to God's clear plan and purpose
>> for His church. What I fear, however, is that some in HC, in their reaction
>> to the ceo/pastor, have actually rejected ANY kind of pastoring or
>> leadership in the Body of Christ. Hey, some have even rejected the idea of
>> any kind of regular meetings!
> 
> Thank you for making this point, and clearly making this point, DanB.
> Now, on to your next paragraph.  I have a question about this
> structure concept.  I do not want to reject it at all, since there is
> structure spoken about in the Bible.  However, our small group which
> comprises just our family has no structure that is noticeable.  And
> perhaps that is the way structure should be known?  i.e. here at
> House Church Talk , there is respect given to each of us here as we learn and see
> the strengths expressed in posts, and some are gifted in not posting,
> but probably prayer - not merely lurkers, but gifted in ways that do
> not post onlist.  So, structure is apparent here, but undefined in
> words.  Can that be the case?  And, can that be the case in a home
> meeting?  Now, if there is an outright rebellion against the order of
> God, certainly there needs to be an attitude shift - and that is what
> I hear you speaking about - proper attitude, thank you for pointing
> that out.
> 
> As to dialog with the traditional structured ways - thank you for your
> notes.  Indeed, this is a difficult process in terms of truth,
> evidence, attitude.  Attitude is huge from my standpoint - I don't
> have a good attitude ;-) when speaking with entrenched structure
> espousing brethren.  God is at work.
> DanG ChicagoArea
>    
>   
>

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